Releasing the Shame of Your Past: Somatic Therapy for ADHD and Trauma Recovery
This week on the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast, Kate is joined by Jennifer McKenzie, a somatic trauma therapist and holistic educator.
This week's episode covers something we haven't explored before: the impact of trauma, abuse, addiction and neurodivergence on the body resulting from years of masking, not fitting in, surviving and never quite feeling safe enough to stop.
Jennifer speaks openly about her trauma and surviving homelessness, addiction, domestic abuse, and rape, raising four children whilst living with chronic pain and disability, and receiving her AuDHD diagnosis later in life. Jennifer's approach to healing is unapologetic and rebellious, reminding us that recovery and self-improvement are possible for everyone, no matter where they start.
In this episode, we explore:
- Jennifer's personal story, the labels she received growing up, and how her lived experience shaped her path and her purpose
- How alcohol and substance use became a way of masking, functioning, and navigating a world that wasn't built for Jennifer
- Why AuDHD women can be particularly vulnerable to risk-taking behaviours, manipulation, and abusive relationships
- The impact of ADHD and autism on female relationships and the ongoing struggle for authentic connection
- How trauma and pain live in the body, from posture and digestive issues to emotional weight and chronic pain
- The role of fascia as the body's second nervous system, how it stores trauma, and its links to conditions like EDS
- The power of movement and somatic therapy in nervous system regulation and genuine, embodied healing
For so many neurodivergent women, the trauma and pain they carry aren't just emotional. It lives in the body, in the nervous system. Jennifer's perspective offers real tools and a deeply compassionate belief that healing is always possible.
The ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live Event Recording is here!
My first-ever ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live event sold out, and now the full experience is available to you wherever you are, whenever it feels right.
Alongside three neuro-affirming experts, we spent four hours exploring the questions that matter most to late-diagnosed women. Get lifetime access here!
Inside the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live Recording, you'll find:
- Kate Moryoussef on post-diagnosis growth and her gentle framework for what comes next
- Dr Hannah Cullen on the neuroscience of ADHD and why your brain works the way it does
- Hannah Miller on reconnecting with purpose through a neurodivergent lens
- Adele Wimsett myth-busting on hormones, HRT, progesterone and perimenopause
Understand yourself more deeply, feel less alone, and finally access the expert knowledge you deserve. Because every woman with ADHD deserves access to the knowledge, expertise and understanding that for too long simply hasn't been available to us.
To get lifetime access for £44, click here.
Join the More Yourself Community - the doors are now open!
More Yourself is a compassionate space for late-diagnosed ADHD women to connect, reflect, learn and come home to who they really are. Sign up here!
Inside the More Yourself Membership, you’ll be able to:
- Connect with like-minded women who understand you
- Learn from guest experts and practical tools
- Receive compassionate prompts & gentle reminders
- Enjoy voice-note encouragement from Kate
- Join flexible meet-ups and mentoring sessions
- Access on-demand workshops and quarterly guest expert sessions
To join for £26 a month, click here. To join for £286 for a year (a whole month free!), click here.
We’ll also be walking through The ADHD Women’s Wellbeing Toolkit together, exploring nervous system regulation, burnout recovery, RSD, joy, hormones, and self-trust, so the book comes alive in a supportive community setting.
Today's episode sponsors:
If perimenopause has felt like the lid has come off your ADHD traits, today's podcast sponsor is for you. Adele Wimsett is a Women's Health Practitioner specialising in ADHD and perimenopause, helping women understand what's actually driving their anxiety, overwhelm, brain fog and burnout through a hormone-literate, nervous-system-led lens. Most women are managing symptoms without ever being told the hormonal piece, but having the correct knowledge and support around this can change everything.
Visit Adele's website for free resources or to book a clinic appointment: www.harmoniseyou.co.uk
Links and Resources:
- Find my popular ADHD workshops and resources on my website [here].
- Follow the podcast on Instagram: @adhd_womenswellbeing_pod
- Find out more about Jennifer's work by visiting her website
- You can also connect with Jennifer on Facebook, LinkedIn and Instagram (@iam_jennifermckenzie)
- Download Jennifer's E-book for tips to connect more to yourself, your emotions, and heal mind, body, and soul.
Kate Moryoussef is a women's ADHD lifestyle and wellbeing coach and EFT practitioner who helps overwhelmed and unfulfilled newly diagnosed ADHD women find more calm, balance, hope, health, compassion, creativity and clarity.
Transcript
Welcome to the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast.
Speaker A:I'm Kate Moore Youssef and I'm a wellbeing and lifestyle coach, EFT practitioner, mum to four kids and passionate about helping more women to understand and accept their amazing ADHD brains.
Speaker A:After speaking to many women just like me and probably you, I know there is a need for more health and lifestyle support for women newly diagnosed with adhd.
Speaker A:In these conversations, you'll learn from insightful guests, hear new findings, and discover powerful perspectives and lifestyle tools to enable you to live your most fulfilled, calm and purposeful life wherever you are on your ADHD journey.
Speaker A:Here's today's episode.
Speaker A:Welcome back to another episode of the.
Speaker B:ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast.
Speaker B:I'm here today with a very interesting guest and I'm really hoping that we're going to talk about things that potentially we haven't covered on the podcast before.
Speaker B:I will mention that we're going to be talking about substance abuse and domestic abuse and more difficult conversations.
Speaker B:But this is all with a view to hopefully find ways that we can release this from our bodies, that we can release this from our nervous systems and recognize what's happened to us, but then learn to turn our lives around and move forwards and create and, you know, a new chapter.
Speaker B:And I think any of us can hopefully start to move towards this.
Speaker B:So I want to welcome Jennifer McKenzie to the podcast and she is a somatic trauma therapist, She's a holistic educator and she's also the founder of the Lunar Lounge and Academy and the Liberation Movement and Wellness on the Move.
Speaker B:And she is known for her raw honesty and rebellious approach to healing.
Speaker B:Jennifer is on a mission to help more people release trauma, reconnect with their bodies and reclaim their power without conforming to society's bullshit standards of success or self improvement.
Speaker B:And she has developed a trauma informed method that fuses nervous system regulation, fascia release, energy work and ancient healing principles.
Speaker B:And her work reaches beyond the therapy room, guiding students and facilitators to bring embodied, inclusive healing into their own communities.
Speaker B:And this is all rooted in her lived experience.
Speaker B:So she has survived homelessness, addiction, domestic ab, rape and parenting for children while living with chronic pain and disability.
Speaker B:Diagnosed later in life with Audi hd, she now openly shares her story to challenge stigma, raise awareness and prove that healing and self liberation are possible for everyone no matter where they've come from.
Speaker B:So I want to welcome you, Jennifer, to the podcast and thank you so.
Speaker A:Much for being here.
Speaker C:Thank you for having me, Kate.
Speaker C:That was a long Intro, wasn't it?
Speaker C:Because.
Speaker B:It needed to be done.
Speaker C:Snippet of my life, really.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:But I think it's important that there's sort of context that people can understand, you know, where.
Speaker B:Why you've led to.
Speaker B:To doing the work that you've done.
Speaker B:And so often it is rooted in our own, you know, challenges and trauma and difficulties and, you know, without having to go into too much of the detail.
Speaker B:But I think it is important that you've.
Speaker B:Because you've obviously used your lived experience and now you're helping people release this trauma.
Speaker B:Can you tell us a little bit about what you've gone through and I guess where that has taken you to the work that you do today?
Speaker C:So, really, for me, I always felt like I was misunderstood, you know, in.
Speaker C:And I always felt left out.
Speaker C:Like, in friendship groups, in school.
Speaker C:I just.
Speaker C:It was just not a safe place for me at all.
Speaker C:The way I look, the way I chose to dress, and, you know, I felt like this overarching feeling all my life that there was something wrong with me.
Speaker C:Nobody liked me, and I was just annoying and in the way, like, at home, you know, I was quite a very outgoing, challenging child.
Speaker C:I think my parents might frame that as still am.
Speaker C:Still I'm causing them stress and misery.
Speaker C:But there you go.
Speaker C:That.
Speaker C:That is part of my rebellious nature.
Speaker C:And I. I always had this.
Speaker C:This mad imagination, like, intrusive thoughts from a young age.
Speaker C:And just when something was.
Speaker C:Was about to change or change would happen, I would catastrophize things and.
Speaker C:And I had.
Speaker C:It was very loud and very busy living in my own brain.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And I was so socially awkward as a teenager to the point where, like, someone spoke to me.
Speaker C:I'd, like, go red in the face, like, especially if it was like, a boy or something or someone I fancied.
Speaker B:I used to do that.
Speaker C:And then people used to.
Speaker C:Because then I was embarrassed about my rosy cheeks.
Speaker C:And then people used to call me Rosie and just sing that song to me.
Speaker C:And it was just a horrible place growing up, and I just felt like everybody just misunderstood me.
Speaker C:And I was very highly sensitive as well, so got labeled as a crybaby and all these sorts of things.
Speaker C:Anyway, I discovered alcohol at a young age because I took that first sip and it was like, whoa, what is this?
Speaker C:It felt like a superpower, you know, I must say, oh, my God, I could be anything I want to be.
Speaker C:And all of that noise stopped.
Speaker C:All of my, like, tense, bracing, awkward body language stopped.
Speaker C:And then I had the shame spiral of people would know me as just like quiet and awkward.
Speaker C:And then I would have this explosion.
Speaker C:I'd be dancing around, I'd be saying all these things.
Speaker C:I'd be getting off with boys of left, right and center.
Speaker C:So it was like then when I'd soaked it up and I just filled with all of this shame as well, it was like I was these two different people.
Speaker C:Alcohol became a massive part of my life from the age of 14 and that led me to some risk taking behaviors such as criminality.
Speaker C:And you know, I'm, I'm not ashamed of talking about this, this part of, of my life now because I just look back at that young girl with sadness and a much deeper empathy and compassion really for, you know, why maybe I went down that path.
Speaker C:But I was involved in drugs and taking class A drugs from a young age and doing all sorts of things that I shouldn't be in and out of the criminal courts from.
Speaker C:Yeah, 14 years old, I think was my first like criminal conviction.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:And so at this point, obviously no one was talking about any form of neurodiversity and you were just a troubled kid who was making bad decisions and there was a lot of, I can only imagine, a lot of negative shame and criticism and just like, can you sort yourself out, do better?
Speaker B:And no one, no one at that point, I mean, even still, to this day, we're still not hearing enough about this.
Speaker B:Did you, I guess at this, at this point, did you recognize what was going on?
Speaker B:Did you kind of have this like, understanding that you're doing this because the alcohol was facilitating a part of you that you couldn't access when you were sober?
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker C:So that's why, you know, the, how I felt outweighed the shame that I felt on these, these some occasions.
Speaker C:And so I just wanted to do more of it.
Speaker C:And I, and I wanted that relief.
Speaker C:So in a way, I guess it was self medicating and self soothing from.
Speaker C:Yeah, I was trying to find ways where I could fit in because I didn't particularly want to be a girly girl and wear short skirts and chase after boys.
Speaker C:I was more the tomboy who liked lighting fires, playing wrestling with my brothers and the other boys down the street, beating the crap out of each other and going on the skateboard.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:But, but I couldn't act like that with girls because they didn't want to do those sorts of things.
Speaker C:So I then run my earlier masks was actually becoming a girl.
Speaker C:It was, yeah, like, okay, I'm not gonna fit in with all these other people at all, unless I start dressing, looking and behaving like them.
Speaker C:So sort of through middle school I had all my head shaved underneath and you know, I, I, and I got really bullied on what we call down here, mufti day.
Speaker C:So non school uniform day for, for just being myself.
Speaker C:So for me, my early belief systems was the world is not safe for me to be myself.
Speaker C:I must now create this version that I will be accepted, liked and loved for being somebody different.
Speaker C:And you know, that's how masking begins for young girls who are, are unsupported, unrecognized, undiagnosed autism or adhd.
Speaker C:This is how the risk taking starts because of that longing desire to fit in, to be loved, to be liked and accepted.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And you can't underestimate the vulnerability of a person who's put themselves under that huge amount of pressure to be someone else and to maintain that facade and how exhausting and tiring it is.
Speaker B:How did that kind of impact you?
Speaker B:I mean, did you carry on with this masking, like to fit in, to have female friendships?
Speaker C:Yes, and female friendships are very, very troublesome for me.
Speaker C:I just didn't understand the dynamic.
Speaker C:So, because I'm very straight talking.
Speaker C:So for example, you know, you all getting ready to go to for a night out or something and someone's like, oh, does this look nice on me?
Speaker C:And I'm like, no.
Speaker C:And it's like, that's not the answer they wanted.
Speaker C:I just didn't understand that in between language of what I was supposed to say.
Speaker C:Not.
Speaker C:I just thought, well, that's the answer, right?
Speaker B:Yeah, that's the truth.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yes, totally get that.
Speaker B:I hear that so much in Female Dynamics, you know, with ADHD and autism that, well, we just want to like speak authentically, be kind, you know, but be honest.
Speaker B:And why there's so many games like, what is this?
Speaker B:Like, why do we not understand?
Speaker B:Why is everyone talking in like double entendres?
Speaker B:Like we're not quite getting what people are saying.
Speaker B:And I totally agree with you.
Speaker B:And I think sometimes that's why girls find it easy to be with boys growing up because the boys just say as it is.
Speaker B:And if they're angry, they're angry and if they're having a laugh, they're having a laugh and then no one gets offended.
Speaker B:But that's also, it's challenging in its own way because you don't feel like you're part of a female friendship group.
Speaker C:Part of my healing journey has been a massive healing.
Speaker C:The Feminine wound and, and sort of heeding a lot of that.
Speaker C:But yeah, I had all boyfriends.
Speaker C:I worked in male dominated environments.
Speaker C:I didn't really have female friends, so to speak.
Speaker C:So I grew up with all boys down my street.
Speaker C:I just became one of them in a way.
Speaker C:But it also opened me up to, with the drug use, it opened me up to a huge world of vulnerability.
Speaker C:And I thought people that were my friends were actually using me to get into dangerous situations within the criminal drug world and actually sexually as well.
Speaker C:And in my first experience of those things were in my teenage years as well.
Speaker C:While my brain is still developing, I'm going through a lot of these traumas that are going unprocessed, unrecognized.
Speaker C:I'd been through some sexual assaults or something where consent was not there.
Speaker C:But it was very blurred line.
Speaker C:So I never knew how to speak up about that.
Speaker C:I never knew if that was my duty and my obligation to men or whether I was feeling wrong.
Speaker C:I was feeling like really uncomfortable for a reason.
Speaker C:You know, it was very confusing back then.
Speaker C:It was like, you must kind of keep all of this in and hide all this stuff because of the shame and all of that going on as well.
Speaker C:But you know, I thought I was this tough girl, but I was extremely vulnerable and open to being used in that way as well.
Speaker C:So that's why I look back with a lot of sadness and why I'm really passionate in actually talking about these things.
Speaker B:Yeah, it is so important.
Speaker B:I think you are not on your own.
Speaker B:I think there's so many people that can relate and resonate to exactly what you're saying and have found themselves in similar situations without very much support.
Speaker B:Because back then, I don't know how many years we're talking, but you know, for me, I grew up in the 80s and the 90s and no one was, you know, no one was talking.
Speaker B:You didn't know what those blurred lines were and you didn't know what was right, what was wrong, who you could speak to.
Speaker B:You just knew there was shame.
Speaker B:So it's just easier just to not, not talk about it.
Speaker B:And I think, I hope that things are changing a little bit more.
Speaker B:But I do believe that the more we give platform to these conversations and these stories, that we can speak to our own children and make sure that our own children know, I guess, what is their boundaries and make sure that they understand that there's not blurred lines anymore.
Speaker B:There's very definitive lines.
Speaker B:At the time, did you have any support?
Speaker B:Was there anyone that you could Go to.
Speaker B:Did you have a mentor or someone that you felt that you could be yourself with?
Speaker C:Not really.
Speaker C:I felt most happy when I was on my own, either outside in nature or whether I was swigging and drowning my sorrows in a bottle of, in a bottle of vodka.
Speaker C:So I felt, and God, this makes me quite sad.
Speaker C:Like I felt so desperate for connection.
Speaker C:And yeah, I was born in 82, so yeah, I'm, I grew up in the 80s and 90s also.
Speaker B:Yeah, we were just sort of taught to use alcohol as like a numbing agent and we, you know, that was, that was kind of just it and the binge drinking and just getting drunk the whole time just to kind of almost kind of repress our feelings and emotions.
Speaker B:People didn't really talk about going for counseling or coaching or trauma therapy or somatic work and all this amazing stuff that we have access to now.
Speaker B:It was just expected.
Speaker B:It was either put up, shut up, repress or use some form of substance to get through, you know, whether it's sleeping pills or addictive behavior.
Speaker B:At what point did things turn around for you?
Speaker B:At what point did you say, right, I can't do this anymore, you know, whether it came with a diagnosis.
Speaker B:But were you already on a healing journey beforehand?
Speaker C:So I have been a body work practitioner for 23 years.
Speaker C:So I, and my mum's very holistic.
Speaker C:So I grew up here in with that language.
Speaker C:So it was, it was not a new massive awakening realization for me of the brain, the body.
Speaker C:And I remember my mum gave me Louise Hayes book when I was about 18.
Speaker C:So I was very self aware of these things that were going on.
Speaker C:But for me it wasn't like an escapism, so to speak.
Speaker C:I was, I was trying to function in a world.
Speaker C:So I, I use cocaine and alcohol very, very regularly.
Speaker C:It got to a point where I would, in the morning I'd have a cup of tea, a line to go to work, you know, and it made me feel normal because I was mask and I was trying to fit in and at that point rather than it being, you know, what we, what we are sold to believe an addict looks like, but actually I was a very intelligent, high functioning woman and I was just masking all of this stuff and all this dysregulation in my body and just getting up, like you said, putting up and shutting up and getting on with it and, and I, and I think sometimes we can see addicts as like down and out.
Speaker C:But actually I had a very good job, I had a lovely house and I Drove a really nice car, but on the outside I looked great, but on the inside I was falling apart.
Speaker C: ally came to a, an end and in: Speaker C:And the thing is like when you're so desperate for escapism, you're so desperate for love and connection, it opens you up to the vulnerability of being abused in romantic relationships in your workplace.
Speaker C:And also unsupported and undiagnosed neurodivergent women are more likely to be susceptible and experience things like domestic abuse and sexual assaults.
Speaker B:So that vulnerability that you're talking about, we, we can see how that can show up.
Speaker B:And sadly, I hear that there is a lot of domestic abuse with neurodivergent women, that they are quite strong in their characteristics and have like a deep sense of justice and wanting to create impact in this world.
Speaker B:But there's another part of them that is not worthy, feels that they're not worthy, feels they're not worthy of being cared for or looked after.
Speaker B:Is that something that you went, you went through yourself?
Speaker B:And I do worry and wonder why there is that vulnerability more so with neurodivergent women in relationships.
Speaker C:I, yes, I definitely felt like that I put my experience down to the fact that, that I just felt so lonely, misunderstood.
Speaker C:And I actually didn't know or was told what a healthy relationship is.
Speaker C:We weren't told about domestic abuse at school like the awareness is now.
Speaker C:We weren't told.
Speaker C:We were more told as young girls to serve men.
Speaker C:So all of my kind of relationships with men, I'm bisexual, so I have relationships with men and women and I knew that from a very young age, which is also very common with neurodivergent people as well, is that we're more sexually fluid and sometimes even gender fluid as well.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:But anyway, that's a topic for another time.
Speaker C:So for me, I wanted that belonging.
Speaker C:So I, A, I didn't know what I should and shouldn't accept.
Speaker C:B, I maybe overlooked a lot of it through people pleasing and, and wanting to be.
Speaker C:I'm wanting to be picked, wanting to.
Speaker B:Be loved and liked.
Speaker C:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker C:So combine those two and.
Speaker C:Which is I think then were a bit more open to manipulation as well because even my last relationship was the one where I said absolutely not anymore.
Speaker C:And that were.
Speaker C: And that was ended in: Speaker C:And I was very aware what domestic abuse was then and, and I'd really started to then unpick some of my past and know the signs and things.
Speaker C:And I'm like I'm not standing for this.
Speaker C:And so I managed to get out of that relationship not unscarved because he put me in hospital quite a few times and that was like the last time he threw me backwards down the stairs.
Speaker C:I'm lucky to be here really, because I landed on the back of my head, so.
Speaker C:And I still have like, like neck.
Speaker C:My neck still is.
Speaker C:I've still hold quite a lot of that there.
Speaker C:And like the X rays and everything said in the scan said that hasn't caused any lasting damage.
Speaker C:But I still think that there's the emotion of that there, which is how I work somatically, is that that held emotion and those held memories live in the body, not just in our minds.
Speaker C:There's so much to kind of unpick about how neurodivergent and unsupported neurodivergent girls and women end up in this risk taking and really dangerous situations.
Speaker C:Really?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean, I just, I just hear this sort of constant element of lack of self worth and deserving of being cared for, looked after, liked, loved for the, you know, your own authenticity.
Speaker B:And so you can see like how you've, you know, beautifully described the different layers and then all of a sudden you're in a place where, you know, you're so grateful to be in a relationship and it's kind of, you know, I'll just take that.
Speaker B:Or perhaps on the flip side, many of us have grown up undiagnosed in similar dysfunctional situations and it's a generational thing.
Speaker B:And so we've never had relationships, you know, healthy relationships modeled to us.
Speaker B:And so for us that's the norm.
Speaker B:And because there's been addiction and chaos and family breakdowns and all sorts of different things, criminality, it's kind of what your nervous system knows.
Speaker B:And you kind of go, you know, even though it feels awful, it's almost like a weird version of safety you never see because it's at least I know this chaos.
Speaker B:And I'll go with that because I kind of know how this plays out.
Speaker B:And it sounds like you've found a way to break the pattern and break that.
Speaker B:You know, how that, hopefully how that shows up in your life.
Speaker B:Is this a.
Speaker B:A constant daily intention for you to now almost see how it showed up in your life and then now to move forwards.
Speaker B:And I guess because there's a lot of people that might be listening and going, I'm still in this, like, how do I get out?
Speaker B:How do I break these patterns and the cycles, I Found my find myself in and live a life where my self worth is a priority and me being my authentic self without masking and pretending and having to repress who I am is part of my daily process.
Speaker B:Is that something that you think about most days now or is it more natural for you?
Speaker C:It's way more natural.
Speaker C:I mean I'm talking like 10 years into to my self discovery and unmasking and healing and things like this are not a quick fix.
Speaker C:That's kind of one of the bugbears I have with social media and things is that people are selling you quick fixes and, and they're selling you promises that they can't keep.
Speaker C:And if you imagine you have been through all of that childhood trauma, you've been through abuse, which rewires your brain and your nervous system anyway and you add all that together and then you suddenly discover later in life that oh okay, I'm actually my brain works a bit differently and I have a different neurotype than maybe the next person or the next person.
Speaker C:And it's almost like you have to go back and you have to completely repairing yourself and rewire your brain, which takes time.
Speaker C:Rewire your nervous system.
Speaker C:I go nervous system first, then brain.
Speaker C:Because if you try and go the other way around, you're going to get stopped.
Speaker C:You can have all the beliefs in the world, but if you don't go from.
Speaker C:If your nervous system says that this isn't safe for me to believe this or move forward or be successful or be safe and loved, then it's not going to do it, it's not going to happen for you, which is where you keep going around in the cycle.
Speaker C:So I'm in a place now where like I feel the most grounded, the most centered and the most alive I've ever felt in my whole entire life.
Speaker C:And that's not exaggerating.
Speaker C:And it's taken me a long time and it's been painful, even painful.
Speaker C:And some days, like what you said about chaos is safety, that was safe for me.
Speaker C:You know, criminals, those people I could relate to, I could relate to, to addicts because there was no judgment there.
Speaker C:And it was something that I'd known for over two decades of my life.
Speaker C:So that was safe and that was the hard part was completely rewiring my brain and body to be still.
Speaker C:Ish.
Speaker C:I don't really like being still because I'm quite an active person.
Speaker C:So movement is my top priority.
Speaker C:Whether that's I'm feeling tired, whether that's some.
Speaker C:I need boosting or whether that's I need down regulation.
Speaker C:Movement is always incorporated into my daily life.
Speaker C:But you imagine trying to rewire your whole system, then you've got your brain going, I don't like this.
Speaker C:This person's very nice and kind.
Speaker C:This person must have an ulterior motive.
Speaker C:This person's going to let me down.
Speaker C:This is what your brain's going to keep telling you.
Speaker C:So we're going to sabotage it for you, which is the cycle that we need to break, which is then where having that support from someone who understands the body so understands us from a trauma informed lens and understands how the nervous system works is going to be your biggest asset for helping you to move forward.
Speaker C:And obviously somebody who understands neurodivergence that.
Speaker B:Is exactly sort of segueing into, I guess what I wanted to talk about because so many people have gone through years and decades of therapy, talking, therapy and like you say, so much of it is stored in our nervous system and our body and we don't even, we're not even understanding why we have chronic pain in our back and our shoulders and our jaw or, you know, gut issues or all sorts of things.
Speaker B:That is trauma.
Speaker B:You know, we're trauma related and we can talk and talk and talk.
Speaker B:We know that with ADHD we're very good at talking and overthinking and catastrophizing and ruminating and all the things that our lovely brain likes us to do.
Speaker B:But the hard thing that we find is being in our bodies and being grounded and present and you know, we do have to sort of sit in our bodies and notice what's going on.
Speaker B:And that's another part of us that doesn't love doing that.
Speaker B:We just come like, we'll just power through, power through, just do more, try harder, be more productive.
Speaker B:The burnout cycle kicks in.
Speaker B:So I personally love somatic work.
Speaker B:It's something that I just think is like most forward way with, you know, from mental health.
Speaker B:It's like the bottom down.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Top up.
Speaker B:Is it bottom up?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Bottom up.
Speaker C:Up.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:Bottom up approach where it's like body first and then the brain responds.
Speaker B:Can you tell me a little bit about how you work and I guess what kind of what do you see in your clinic and what, what are you seeing people heal from through this type of work?
Speaker C:Gosh, I always get goosebumps when I talk about this because it's the most beautiful thing to witness.
Speaker C:I'm going to start with that is other people transforming their lives.
Speaker C:And some of the things that my clients have said is like, I've waited my whole life to feel like this.
Speaker C:And you know, it doesn't make me cry because I'm, I'm an empathy.
Speaker C:Although I do have to have that separation, obviously.
Speaker C:But yeah, it fills my heart with love and joy.
Speaker C:And so working somatically, if anybody is not used to that terminology, is basically somatic means soma, body, first body.
Speaker C:So we're working with body practices such as the nervous system regulation.
Speaker C:I'm, I'm working with your body, so I'm working with your fascia, I'm working with your muscles, I'm working with your energy lines and meridians and, and how things like that show up in the body.
Speaker C:Because often we just treat the cognitive.
Speaker C:Right, we just treat the grain, which doesn't it, it does, but it doesn't work for, for people that have lived recently.
Speaker C:People with undiagnosed agency, especially women, just live from here upwards.
Speaker C:We're completely disconnected from our bodies and our bodily sensations, which is why we don't feel thirst cues, hunger cues, toilet cues, is because our main vagus nerve, it's our largest nerve in the central nervous system.
Speaker C:It connects to all of those systems.
Speaker C:You've got poor vaping tone, which you're.
Speaker C:Is not signaling to your brain that I need to eat, I need to eat and all these things.
Speaker C:And that actually blocks off our sensations of, with our joy and our pleasure as well.
Speaker C:So there's lots of aspects where say for example, a typical woman that comes to me has tightness in her shoulders.
Speaker B:That's me.
Speaker C:That is unexpected explained by any kind of medical condition.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:So normally when we have pain in our body, it's three things.
Speaker C:So we look at posture.
Speaker C:Is it from an accident or is it emotional?
Speaker C:Nine times out of ten with the people that I work with, it's emotional.
Speaker C:And then so they've got these tight shoulders, jaws are tight, they are having digestive issues, maybe they're holding some extra water and some weight around the middle section.
Speaker C:99% Of them have experienced some sort of abuse, whether that's childhood abuse, parental abuse within the family, grandparents or something, sexual abuse and then most likely domestic abuse as well.
Speaker C:So people that I work with have experienced trauma.
Speaker C:They're finding it hard to move forward because they don't trust their, themselves, they don't trust their body, they don't trust themselves.
Speaker C:So they are confusing their intuition with survival responses.
Speaker C:One woman I worked with, she was like in her late 60s.
Speaker C:So it's never ever too late to kind of Recognize this stuff that's going on in your body.
Speaker C:So another thing is like irregular cycles.
Speaker C:Then, then these things can show up or you think that they're related to other things.
Speaker C:But when you begin to actually go nervous system first in, you know, life, love and business, then these things start to change.
Speaker C:And I'm not saying everything is about that because one person is one person.
Speaker C:We have to look at lots of different factors that, that I go through in like consultation and things like that.
Speaker C:So I make sure that they've had like medical intervention with the blood test done to make sure that there's no underlying deficiencies and things like that.
Speaker C:So I look at a comprehensive consultation when I'm working with people because I don't believe one size fits all.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think it's.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's important that you said that because there's a lot in our blood work and we know that we are often deficient, you know, ferritin B12.
Speaker B:I'm thinking, you know, hormones as well.
Speaker B:And I think it's so good that you do that because that can then in turn help with the work, I guess that you do as well.
Speaker B:So it's sort of like a two pronged approach certainly that I'm becoming fascinated in is, is the role of fascia and understanding what that is and understanding how that holds trauma, especially sort of the connective tissue.
Speaker B:And we know that there's a lot of people, neurodivergent people that have hypermobility and air loss danlos chronic pain.
Speaker B:Can you explain a little bit?
Speaker B:Because I think you'll probably know more than I do about why understanding the fascia is important and what that holds.
Speaker C:Yeah, if you, if you think of your fascia as your second nervous system and our fascia is emotional rather than physical.
Speaker C:So the fascia then is the intertwining and it's the webbing and it's the protective webbing that goes over some muscles and in between.
Speaker C:So it's throughout our whole body and it connects our head to our feet through different fascial lines.
Speaker C:And if you think of where your muscles are contracting and bracing when we're in survival or stress mode, that fascia is also listening and contracting and freezing.
Speaker C:So when we've got a lot of.
Speaker C:This is why fascial work is really good for when we're working with emotional release and trauma release because it remembers it stores in our body and it braces for impact all the time.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker C:They're basing for danger.
Speaker C:Should I say like.
Speaker B:So it's Like a, it's almost like a protective layer.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:With the fascia work, what would that entail?
Speaker C:So for me, I have put together a methodology which is my body work and I, and I teach a course on it now as well.
Speaker C:So we're coming from a trauma informed lens.
Speaker C:So we have, you know, you have got traditional massage which works petrissage and helping to move the lymph in some respects and also relax the body, relax the muscles.
Speaker C:But here we're actually working in a different way because it's not necessarily about going digging deep into somebody's body, it's about creating a space where that body feels safe to breathe and let go.
Speaker C:As you think of how emotions get trapped in our body, they're not, they're not trapped.
Speaker C:I'm, I don't like using that word, stark or trapped.
Speaker C:Actually.
Speaker C:It, they're held, they're held under our armor.
Speaker C:And this is how I describe it.
Speaker C:We, we've got this protective layer, we've got this protective armor on us.
Speaker C:And then these different masks of, of ourselves then, and these parts of ourselves that we're holding on to and we're protecting is because that we don't feel safe enough for them to be seen, for them to be witnessed.
Speaker C:Maybe they, these.
Speaker C:Because these things sometimes happen in early childhood.
Speaker C:We don't have the development, we don't have the words to express that.
Speaker C:So it's, it's very confusing for a little child who's, who's then been told to be silent.
Speaker C:So that's where we store it all in our throat and our voice.
Speaker C:So I'm working with your body, but I'm also working with your voice activation.
Speaker C:And some people start and they can't even hum.
Speaker C:They're like tiny noise.
Speaker C:By the end of it, we're like, we've got a deep connection to our, to our voice and our body and, and you know, people think it's really woo woo.
Speaker C:But you know what, it's actual science, the science of emotion.
Speaker C:And it's something that I'm so like passionate about helping people with because it's often an overlooked part of recovery.
Speaker C:Because we taught ADHD is in the brain.
Speaker C:ADHD is this.
Speaker C:ADHD is, is how your brain works.
Speaker C:You've got to train your brain, retrain your brain.
Speaker C:But actually it is so much in the body, like you said about Ellis Daniels and POTS and things like that.
Speaker C:It's these fibromyalgia, something I was diagnosed with after I went through years and years of trauma.
Speaker C: hen I Came out of Hospital in: Speaker C:I was diagnosed then with fibromyalgia.
Speaker C: And that point in: Speaker C:I don't believe I've got all of these things wrong with me.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And funny just.
Speaker C:It.
Speaker C:It's funny enough, I was looking at something on the Internet and.
Speaker C:And trauma came up, and I was like, why isn't anybody ever spoke to me about trauma in my whole entire life?
Speaker C:Of all the things that I've gone through, all the labels that psychiatry wants to give me, which I no longer particularly wanted to relate to.
Speaker C:And I'm about moving beyond the label, moving beyond the diagnosis, and actually looking at this whole picture, a whole person, rather than focusing on one thing they really need to lose.
Speaker C:I call it the big D right at the end of all of these things.
Speaker C:So it all ends in disorder.
Speaker C:Adhd, ASD is the big D. I think me, like, I really want to look on and lose that and look at things as a bigger picture rather than like, we're all disordered when really we need support and understanding.
Speaker B:Correct.
Speaker B:100.
Speaker B:And I think you know what you're saying about the fibromyalgia.
Speaker B:I've never met one woman who has been given a diagnosis of fibromyalgia that hasn't gone through trauma.
Speaker B:You know, I see this now.
Speaker B:It's just like, it's a body response.
Speaker B:It's your body's response.
Speaker B:Whether it's like you say, it's the fascia, the connective tissue, the muscles, the nervous system, It's a reaction.
Speaker B:It's not just something that you have.
Speaker B:And, you know, and that's why I love this, these kind of conversations, because it's giving women the empowerment and the articulation and the understanding to separate themselves.
Speaker B:Like you say with the inverted commas, the disorders that they've been given, and find ways to use their voice and no longer shrink and mask and suppress.
Speaker B:And all the things that we've been told are the right, the best ways, just keep quiet and just crack on.
Speaker B:That's not applicable anymore.
Speaker B:Now that we understand all of this, my question is, is, do you work with people online?
Speaker B:I'm listening to you and thinking, oh, my God, that voice work.
Speaker B:That could just be so helpful for women who just.
Speaker B:They just want to be quiet.
Speaker B:It's easier to be quieter.
Speaker B:They've been told it's safe to stay quiet.
Speaker B:And how do you do the bodywork?
Speaker B:Is it only in person?
Speaker C:So I have.
Speaker C:You can work with me online?
Speaker C:Yes, so you can work with me online and.
Speaker C:But obviously I can't get my hands on you through, through the Internet.
Speaker C:So I prefer to work in person because I can do the breath work and the, the releasing online because I get you to go into your own gateways of the body.
Speaker C:So I call them emotional gateways when we're working on the body.
Speaker C:So if I'm working with you in person, I will be going into your gateways helping you to release that.
Speaker C:So what happens like twitching happens and emotional release and voice release and all that.
Speaker C:So if I'm working online, you'll be, you wouldn't be in quite so much of a state.
Speaker C:You'd be a little bit more conscious because I've been asking you to, to go into the different parts of your body.
Speaker C:But firstly I take you into a breath work journey so that we switch off the conscious mind and we're going into the unconscious and the subconscious.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker C:They just allow for safety and it just switches off safety mechanism that your brain is just trying to tell you that it's not okay for us to do this.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And coming back, I know you said you're training.
Speaker B:We've created a framework with the fascia especially I've just been doing online kind of like a fascia, fascia sort of stretching yoga style thing.
Speaker B:Just, you know, working with hips and all different things and just getting into the different areas of the body that my yoga class doesn't quite do.
Speaker B:Just because I'm just personally very interested in it.
Speaker B:Do you what I would love to see is more like being able to just Google like can I where's in a fascia sort of massage type treatment?
Speaker B:Is that, is that a thing?
Speaker B:Is that something that you do?
Speaker B:Because we need these things to be more accessible and we need like you say to drop the woo to start understanding that like you say there's science behind this, there's understanding behind this and maybe we don't want to go and talk for an hour because that's really exhausting and we've already relayed our story a million times and we've still not got to a point where anyone, the past can't be changed.
Speaker B:Like we just know that.
Speaker B:So we want to heal and we want to be able to live.
Speaker B:We live better and sometimes it just needs to come out of our body.
Speaker B:That's why I love using EFT and tapping so much because that's, that's that release you get.
Speaker B:Can you have like a fascia sort of massagey type thing?
Speaker B:Sorry to not use all the right words, that's fine.
Speaker C:So what I put together is called Awaken and Release Body work and that's.
Speaker C:Then you can do a personal course with me so you can come to my studios, my world wellbeing practices and you have a series of six sessions over the course of three months.
Speaker C:So I don't just do one off sessions anymore because it's not enough because we just get started, you know.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:Yes, and you can have that with me for your own personal healing and release or you can do the course, which is an accredited course and it's something that I put together for other practitioners to learn so that I can get this work further and wider over the uk.
Speaker C:You know, to start with.
Speaker B:Yeah, tell me where, where you're based and I guess people might want to get in touch with you and travel to where, to where you are as well.
Speaker C:Yeah, I do have people come from all over the uk, so I'm based in Bedfordshire and I have my training academy here and then I have my one to one garden spa as well.
Speaker C:So we focus on like all aspects of, of well being, mainly recovery and, and then I also do like the infrared sauna stuff, the contrast therapy and so you can like, literally you can book a private experience because, and because I work with a lot of neurodivergent people, I've opened up that space for them.
Speaker C:So, you know, sometimes you go to a spa, don't you, and there's so many other people and it's like I'm actually listening to all of your conversations all at once.
Speaker C:I can't listen to what my friend's saying because I'm too invested in what's going on and then I come out of it being actually not really feeling stimulated.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:So I vote, yeah.
Speaker C:I've opened up a space where people can come and just have that complete private, best fight experience where they can just completely shut off and go inward and relax.
Speaker C:And that's what I'm all about is going inwards first to, to make the outer a lot more joyful and happy, I suppose, like we're not always going to be happy, are we?
Speaker C:But you know, we can work on those inner, those inner bits that make the outer a lot more manageable, let's say.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:Because, you know, listen, the external world is always going to be there, but we don't need to carry with us every, every last thing, you know, that's ever happened.
Speaker B:We can slowly begin to release that to make life a bit lighter, I would say a bit more peaceful.
Speaker B:And bit lighter and I think what you're doing is, is, is, is amazing.
Speaker B:Thank you so much for your time today, Jennifer.
Speaker B:Really appreciate it.
Speaker B:Thank you for sharing so honestly with vulnerability and really giving people the opportunity to hear your story because I'm sure that they will relate and I would love to come down to where you are and give this all a go because I just, I love it all.
Speaker B:But in the meantime, Jennifer, thank you so much and I will hopefully speak to you again very soon.
Speaker C:Thank you.
Speaker C:Kate,.
Speaker B:Thank you for being here and.
Speaker A:Listening to today's episode.
Speaker A:I just want to remind you that if you are looking for more support on your ADHD journey, there are so many resources waiting for you over@adhdwomenswellbeing.co.uk so inside the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Workshop library, you'll find practical and compassionate guidance on topics such as nervous nervous system regulation, rejection, sensitive dysphoria, perfectionism, emotional regulation, hormones, parenting, and so much more.
Speaker A:All designed specifically for late diagnosed neurodivergent women.
Speaker A:You can also explore my new book, the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Toolkit, which was published by dk, which is also available in ebook and audiobook, which is packed full of tools to help you feel calm, calmer, more regulated and more like yourself.
Speaker A:And if you do crave a bit more deeper connection and ongoing support, come and join us inside the More Yourself community.
Speaker A:It's a gentle space for learning, reflection and connection with other neurodivergent women.
Speaker A:And you'll also find the recordings from our first ever ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live event, which brought together incredible speakers and a room full of inspiring women for a truly special day.
Speaker A:We have recorded it all for you and it's there to buy.
Speaker A:So whether you're just starting your journey or looking to go deeper, there's something there for every stage.
Speaker A:Just head to ADHD womenswellbeing.co.uk to explore everything.
Speaker A:And as always, thank you so much for being here and for being part of this community.
